'Putting 180 women in Parliament will help only
their husbands -- not women or the nation!'
How Readers reacted to Vir Sanghvi's recent columns
Date sent: Mon, 21 Dec 1998 12:49:59 -0600
From: Ramsundar Lakshminarayanan ɜram@relay-1.ziplink.net>
Subject: Vir Sanghvi's column
Let's formulate and pass a Hindu constitution and then give reservations for Muslims. We are supposed to be having a "secular" Constitution, where there is no question of religion-based reservations. Do you want India to go the way of Yugoslavia?
Ramsundar Lakshminarayanan
Date sent: Mon, 21 Dec 1998 13:48:51 -0600
From: vu2ash <vu2ash@altavista.net>
Subject: Vir Sanghvi's column
You just proved yourself a pseudo-secular in journalist's clothing. You write, "Let's assume that this explanation is valid. But then, we have a new problem. By nearly every parameter, there is one group in this country that is at least as worse off as women. India's Muslims are a poor, ill-educated minority and suffer appalling discrimination. Statistics show how few government jobs are occupied by Muslims. There is not one Muslim-owned unit in the first 500 industrial units in the country. The Muslim per capita income is far lower than the Hindu income. And though Muslims comprise between 12 and 15 per cent of the population, they occupy far fewer seats proportionately in Parliament."
The reasons Muslims are in this state is their own fault. Their ghetto mentality, their unwillingness to be part of the national mainstream, blaming all their ills on a Hindu majority and looking for every problem at hand through the religious angle. This clearly contrasts with women's issues where they (women) have been unfairly dominated for centuries. That (domination/subjugation of women), as I mentioned somewhere else on Rediff, again is a
result of Islamic invasions and subsequently their rule. Pre-Islamic history of India shows a number of learned women who excelled in every contemporary sphere of life.
By comparing women's issue with that of the Muslims, you make it seem that
there is a well-implemented strategy by Hindus to discriminate against them. Nothing can be further from the truth. Hindus do not need to prove their secular credentials. A couple of examples like Dr A P J Abdul Kalam and Mr Sikander Bakht prove it amply.
It's the Muslims who need to get out of their backward mentality. This is especially true now with the awakened majority who's willing to assert its right if necessary. Quoting scriptures from the medieval and Quran will not serve them any good. It's what will surely bring them (and India along with them) down.
Going by your logic, we Maharashtrians (who are not industrious enough) deserve reservations too since we do not figure in the first 500 industrial units in the country. You may be arguing against any kind of reservations here but you're at the same time stoking the fires that if not smothered now will result in a carnage.
Date sent: Mon, 21 Dec 1998 15:16:44 -0500
From: Raghu Rao <raov@sybase.com>
Subject: Article regarding reservation for women
This article doesn't make much sense. What is he trying to say? He should have concentrated only on one issue. He says reservations are not good and should be discouraged. Then he says if at all reservations are provided, we should have some for Muslims. Are you trying to be the messiah of Muslims?
Sanghvi, please try to put only one idea forward at a time. Why do you always pick negative people like Jayalalitha to exemplify women? Why don't you mention about Sonia Gandhi? A recent example who proved that she can manage much better than her male counterparts in the Congress party? Don't you think Rabri Devi is doing her job much better than Laloo, even though she is uneducated? Do you think Sonia or Rabri would have to come to power if Rajiv was alive or Laloo wasn't chargesheeted? This is the reason for demanding reservations to women.
Also please don't compare women's life in the US to that in India. In the US, women virtually hold all the power even if they don't rule the country. Law respects them.
In our culture/society the only way of bringing women on par with men is to provide them with reservations.
I don't think you are an MCP, right?
Date sent: Mon, 21 Dec 1998 16:12:02 -0500
From: Tarun Seam <tseam@doubled.com>
Subject: Vir Sanghvi on reservation?
Is Pakistan listening? The man is insanely displeased with a Hindu society and seems to be dying to convert. Send the man one of your "big" medals, along with an honorary citizenship and a one way ticket to Islamabad.
Tarun Seam
Date sent: Mon, 21 Dec 1998 13:20:21 -0800
From: VK <vkp@unlinfo.unl.edu>
Subject: Vir Sanghvi on reservation!
Vir has put in a lot of thought and sense into this column. Many, just for the heck of it, might have a problem understanding the quality of Vir's thought; but in true essence his premise is a powerful statement that has shown to erode the unity and democracy of our system.
The fallacy of this is leading to racism of all sorts, consequently depleting trust among different sections of our society. Although we preach about India's unity amidst diversity, in
reality, we have no clue what it means.
I would like to see more of such quality articles on Rediff.
Venkat Kumar
Ohio
Date sent: Mon, 21 Dec 1998 11:12:23 -0800 (PST)
From: Neeraj Rai <rneeraj@yahoo.com>
Subject: The nonsense of reservation
Vir Sanghvi voices some of the sane opinions appearing on Rediff.
His maturity helps him analyse both sides of the argument before reaching a conclusion.
Date sent: Tue, 22 Dec 1998 08:19:36 +0530
From: "Raghavendra Babu .H.C" <raghu@meghadoot.hiso.honeywell.com>
Subject: The nonsense of reservation
Once again a very nice one! It's a shame that we link up everything with religion & reservation. As you said, every party openly accepts that women should get proper representation in Parliament, but when it comes to the matter of issuing tickets they simply shut their mouths. The same is going to happen even after the Women's Reservation Bill is passed: if Mulayam's constituency is reserved for women, his wife will get his seat, that's all. Like in Bihar, where Laloo is leading the government in the name of Rabri Devi, Mr XYZ will lead his constituency in his wife's name. Putting 180 women into Parliament is not going to help neither women nor the nation -- only their husbands!
Raghu
Date sent: Wed, 23 Dec 1998 14:20:52 +0800
From: "P.B.Krishnaswamy" <pibik@giasmd01.vsnl.net.in>
Subject: Vir Sanghvi's column on Women's reservation
I enjoyed reading the piece immensely.
P B Krishnaswamy
Date sent: Wed, 23 Dec 1998 15:41:31 +0530
From: Divya Maheshwari <divyamah@geocities.com>
Subject: Vir Sanghvi on women's reservation
I loved reading Vir Sanghvi. Though I agree with him on doing away with reservations, I still support this particular bill on the ground that there is a basic difference between reservation for SC/ST/OBC's etc and that for women .The number of women parliamentarians clearly demonstrates the lack of voluntary political effort by parties. Reservation seems to be the only way out. Reservation for SC/ST/OBCs etc has been around for 50 years now and still there is little that has been done. This has been primarily because the benefits were mainly absorbed by the 'creamy layer', as Vir Sanghvi said. But I would like to point out that there are no such internal divisions in the women's bill. The bill is for women as a
whole and I do not support any further reservation within the allocated 33 % for SC/ST/OBC women.
I also want to point out the fact that though there were initial hiccups about reservations in panchayats (like the woman
being a proxy for her husband), the situation greatly improved with time, and women successfully solved basic problems like fetching water from distant places daily as they were the ones who had to do it earlier. This is, however, a very simple example. Ideally speaking, it is not essential (as pointed out by Vir Sanghvi) that it requires a woman to solve a woman's problems; but practical situations show that this is not always the case.
Look at the apathy with which rape victims are interrogated and treated! Certainly, a larger representation of women in the judiciary would help lessen these. The case in Parliament is also somewhat like this.
The basic difference between reservation for SC/ST/OBCs and that
for women is that the difference between a man and a woman is nature-created and can't be eliminated, while differences between one man and another, one woman and another, on the basis of caste, creed, religion, race etc is something which have been created by people. This is what we should strive to eliminate, and reservation on this basis is what we should attack. We stand nothing to lose if women get a representation of 33% in Parliament, we will all gain from it. I personally feel it will have a very good effect on the behaviour of MPs, because women will definitely improve the level of decency that exists in Parliament today. But we have a lot to lose if the thrust of this bill shifts from reservation for women to pre-determined reservation for 'various classes among women'.
I will be happy to reply to emails from anyone who would like to enrich me with their views on this topic.
Divya
Date sent: Tue, 15 Dec 1998 14:36:36 -0600
From: vu2ash <vu2ash@altavista.net>
Subject: Vir Sanghvi
As far as the media is concerned, the BJP is a hopeless case. Damn if he does something, damn if he doesn't. Guys, please, please give a long rope to the BJP to hang-on or hang themselves. A quick look at the political leadership in India will
reveal that the party has got the most disciplined, articulate and wise lot. Given enough time without pre-judgement by the media, this is the only party that can bring India out of its morass. The operative words here are 'enough time' and 'without prejudice'.
Date sent: Mon, 14 Dec 1998 15:57:30 -0800 (PST)
From: sunil g <sunil_sarma@yahoo.com>
Subject: Vir Sanghvi article
I wonder sometimes what journalism has got reduced to.
Let out your steam on your opponents with or without
facts, with one belief that a lie repeated a thousand
times becomes truth. I have never seen Advani or Vajpayee speaking against one
another. In fact, I remember, Advani, when he was considered the strongest man in his party, made way for Vajpayee. In fact in his last interview, he said: "I
consider Vajpayee to be my senior and want to work under him." Of course their way of working will be different because they are not 'brain-dead people'. From which coloured glass did Vir Sanghvi see a cold war between Advani and
Vajpayee, I do not know.
It is also disgusting to find that the writer is talking such rubbish about the great leader Sardar Vallabhai Patel who
unified the whole India. I wonder whether a popular newsgroup like Rediff is on a suicide mission by letting such unscrupulous writers write articles. Or is it that Rediff also shares the same view as Vir Sanghvi?
Sunil Sharma
NY
Date sent: Tue, 15 Dec 1998 08:25:47 +0700
From: "Sanjay" <sanjay@skyhwk.enet.qntm.com>
Subject: If he can get his act together...
Well-balanced and well-written. It would be a great favour to Indian politics if we could get rid of the third force of Laloo, Mulayam and the Leftists. The Leftists are having a single-point agenda of opposing the government. We need a two-party system and a sensible and responsible politician to govern the country.
Sanjay Gawande
Indonesia
Date sent: Mon, 14 Dec 1998 14:13:16 -0800
From: Shyam Sundar Chandrasekaran <shyamc@qualcomm.com>
Subject: Vir Sanghvi's article
Obviously Sanghvi has some sort of evidence that suggests Sonia Gandhi does not want to become the prime minister. People who believe otherwise, including me, are waiting for him to disclose it.
Shyam
Date sent: Tue, 15 Dec 1998 01:58:30 EST
From: Tonydsilva@aol.com
Subject: If he can get his act together...
Very true. There is only one clear and indisputable leader and statesman in the Sangh
Parivar. And that is Vajpayee. If only he can call a spade a spade and lead the BJP. If only he can look into his own strengths and be bold like Patel and even Indira. If only he can
lead the Sangh Parivar not to protect Ram Janamsthan (Ayodhya), but Ramjanam bhoomi (Indian nation), and focus not on winning the IRA for a few MNCs but roti
kapda aur makhan for the majority (which includes focusing on infrastructure, job creation, banking reform with modern technology etc). If only... If only Vajpayeeji will begin to act, and act fast, neither the Congress nor the third force will be able to shake the BJP for the next 25 years.
Tony D'Silva
Date sent: Mon, 14 Dec 1998 11:35:19 -0800
From: Sameer <skuppaha@sedona.ch.intel.com>
Subject: Vajpayee still could be a winner
If Vir Sanghvi's intent is to rub the members of the Sangh Parivar the wrong way, he certainly has a way with it. Without resorting to general criticism, I would like to point out some holes in his comments:
"A weak finance minister will allow S Gurumurthy and the other Bharat Natyam dancers to run
the show from behind the scenes."
Well, it is better to have some "Bharat Natyam dancers" running the show than the monkeys in the Italian circus company, right? The point I am trying to make: If you bluntly want to criticise the Sangh leadership because you suffer from delusion, then I certainly understand the insanity in your thought-process. But if you really want to make a point gracefully and respectfully, then you can criticise the RSS in a mature manner, without resorting to adjectives.
From your articles, it is quite clear that you have no first-hand experience with anyone in the RSS. So, your making obnoxious remarks about the RSS will cut no ice. The fact is that the RSS is a voluntary organisation. It is an organisation that exists freely in a democratic country. It commands respect of a few million Indians. Just because it doesn't suit your shallow thinking does not mean that you can brand it evil. Every government has king-makers and back-room politicians. So what is wrong if the RSS is playing that role now? You write as if Rajiv
Gandhi did not have behind-the-scene manipulators? Or, for that matter, Sonia Gandhi now? Now you will say I am a fanatic! Well, that's your problem.
"So, if he can get his act together, Vajpayee may well emerge as a winner from this defeat. He finally has a chance to remind his party that Nagpur is a long way from New Delhi and assert that history has demonstrated that even a successful Vallabhbhai Patel must play second fiddle to Jawaharlal Nehru. And as for a Sardar Patel who is costing the party election after election... well, that should be self-evident."
Please don't exaggerate. This is the first election in recent times
which saw a BJP debacle. So what "elections after elections" are you talking about? And Advani never sees himself in the mould of Sardar Patel. Well, everyone in the RSS reveres Sardar Patel. You have a problem with that? And if you want to learn something from history, learn this: Nobody plays second fiddle to anyone, unless they really want to. That is at least the case in the "right" side of the world. I know such is not the case where you come from. If the Congress knew how to conduct the music themselves, they wouldn't need an Italian housewife to rescue them. Then the only fiddle they can play is the
second one!
Moral of the story: Gone are the days when writers like you took advantage of public ignorance and condemn the RSS for everything. No matter how hard you try to hit at the RSS, it will fly in your face. Heard of a boomerang?
Date sent: Mon, 14 Dec 1998 11:28:30 -0800 (PST)
From: Chockkalingam A <chocks_a@yahoo.com>
Subject: Vir Sanghvi's column
What are you trying to say? Sonia's ambition is to revive the Congress? I will ask you to please stop such illogical writing. The Congressmen want power. For that, they are using her. She doesn't have any plans or ambition for the modern India. She doesn't have any political training or complete understanding about the Indian society. It is the fate of India to rely on such persons as its future PM.
Just b'cos you don't like Advani or the BJP you can't pour nonsense on them. Rediff, we expect unbiased articles/columns from you.
Chokkalingam
Date sent: Mon, 14 Dec 1998 11:26:42 PST
From: "Uppili Vasu" <uppilivasu@hotmail.com>
Subject: Vajpayee and Vir Sanghvi
It is unfortunate that a man of your calibre has to stoop so low
to convince the people of your ability. You have made a good attempt to change from your previous style of BJP bashing, but it still remains an effort that lacks the winning punch. You always try to push through your hidden agenda, even though in this article you wrapped it under cover, which was unfortunately torn and your game is up again.
The BJP as a political party may have its shortcomings. But their only agenda, which no one can dispute, is that they
want to see this country becoming strong, self-reliant and assertive. Where as the party to which you seem to be showing your loyalty to is more loyal to one particular family and not to the nation. You should try to shake off the thick layer of sycophancy which envelops your
articles and let your pen speak for the betterment of the Indian
society, not for your personal political gain. You can do a great favour to the readers of Rediff if you can tell us the source of your Atalji-Advani friction. Maybe you cannot directly tell us this but you can certainly say "A senior BJP functionary who wants to be anonymous," which will at least convince 5% of Rediff readers.
Vasu
PS: Joining hands with people like Dilip D'Souza and Darryl D'Monte may be good in the short run, but in the long run you will find that it will cause irreparable damage to your political ambitions.
Vir Sanghvi
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